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Don't have the where's and by who, but I saw the new pending state record striper at the VB Fishing Center this afternoon....68+ pounds!!! Good Lord it was big!!! Congrats to the angler!!!!
WOW THATS A BIG ONE!!!!!!!!!! congrats on whoever caught it... are there any pics?
The who...Clay Armstrong and the fish was 68.1 pounds!!!
I'm sure pics will show up soon...the fish was huge with a big ol' belly on it!!!
I'm sure pics will show up soon...the fish was huge with a big ol' belly on it!!!
Wish that was my fish...didn't make it out due to unforseen circumstances. definately going out tomorrow though.....heard the big one was actually caught around False Cape...68.1 as stated earlier...private boat.....gonna go find out if theres a 68.2 pound fish out there tomorrow !!!!!!!!!!!...awesome...congrats to the boat and angler on a truely awesome fish....Bob
That's not a cow, that's a Water Buffalo! Pictures will be posted tonight on the Virginia Beach Fishing Center Website at 7:30
Thats a nice one,I can only hope they will hang around long enough to catch some of his friends.
nICE fish congrats to the angler
Congrats to the Angler. There is more info on the VA Beach Fishing center website where the had it weighed. Didnt say what they caught it on, but did say it took 25 minutes to boat it. What a Hog........It was only a matter of time.
Mike
Mike
Here are more details that will be in the Pilot
Mechanicsville man hooks state mark with 68-1 striper
By LEE TOLLIVER, The Virginian-Pilot
© March 5, 2006
Last updated: 1:30 AM
VIRGINIA BEACH - It has become an annual event.
Once again, an angler has broken the state record for striped bass.
Clay Armstrong of Mechanicsville caught a 68-pound, 1-ounce rockfish while fishing in the Atlantic Ocean off Virginia Beach on Saturday. The 33-year-old road construction worker broke the mark of 63-8 established by Paul Kleckner in February 2005 off Wachapreague.
Catching such a fish in March is somewhat unusual. But large striped bass have remained in the area off Virginia Beach and upper North Carolina a little later this year because of warmer-than-average waters and plentiful bait.
Armstrong, who keeps his boat, "Fin Addict," docked at the Virginia Beach Fishing Center, was fishing about 14 miles south of Rudee Inlet. He was trolling umbrella rigs that featured chartreuse paddle-tail baits.
Armstrong knew that the fish was big. He's no stranger to big stripers.
"We had a 62-15 on my boat last year, so I had a pretty good idea this was a big fish by the way it was pulling," Armstrong said. "We've had a 53-pounder, a 50-pounder and lots in the 30-pound range."
Most of those fish were caught by friends on Armstrong's boat. Armstrong said his largest rockfish to date weighed 38 pounds.
"This is exciting," Armstrong said. "There was a lot of yelling and screaming on the boat and when we got this thing on the scales. I'd imagine they could hear us all the way back at the docks when this fish hit the deck."
In previous years, Armstrong's catch would not have made the record books. Armstrong holds a commercial rod-and-reel fishing license. In the past, holders of such licenses were not eligible for awards from the Virginia Saltwater Fishing Tournament . But the rule was changed late last year to allow commercial fishermen to compete.
Mechanicsville man hooks state mark with 68-1 striper
By LEE TOLLIVER, The Virginian-Pilot
© March 5, 2006
Last updated: 1:30 AM
VIRGINIA BEACH - It has become an annual event.
Once again, an angler has broken the state record for striped bass.
Clay Armstrong of Mechanicsville caught a 68-pound, 1-ounce rockfish while fishing in the Atlantic Ocean off Virginia Beach on Saturday. The 33-year-old road construction worker broke the mark of 63-8 established by Paul Kleckner in February 2005 off Wachapreague.
Catching such a fish in March is somewhat unusual. But large striped bass have remained in the area off Virginia Beach and upper North Carolina a little later this year because of warmer-than-average waters and plentiful bait.
Armstrong, who keeps his boat, "Fin Addict," docked at the Virginia Beach Fishing Center, was fishing about 14 miles south of Rudee Inlet. He was trolling umbrella rigs that featured chartreuse paddle-tail baits.
Armstrong knew that the fish was big. He's no stranger to big stripers.
"We had a 62-15 on my boat last year, so I had a pretty good idea this was a big fish by the way it was pulling," Armstrong said. "We've had a 53-pounder, a 50-pounder and lots in the 30-pound range."
Most of those fish were caught by friends on Armstrong's boat. Armstrong said his largest rockfish to date weighed 38 pounds.
"This is exciting," Armstrong said. "There was a lot of yelling and screaming on the boat and when we got this thing on the scales. I'd imagine they could hear us all the way back at the docks when this fish hit the deck."
In previous years, Armstrong's catch would not have made the record books. Armstrong holds a commercial rod-and-reel fishing license. In the past, holders of such licenses were not eligible for awards from the Virginia Saltwater Fishing Tournament . But the rule was changed late last year to allow commercial fishermen to compete.
Construction worker with a boat at Rudee?
He probably is not the guy swinging the hammer.
Nice fish.
Rememeber back in Dec when everyone was saying that it was the worst year of striper fishing???
He probably is not the guy swinging the hammer.
Nice fish.
Rememeber back in Dec when everyone was saying that it was the worst year of striper fishing???
what a catch! congratulations.
the commercial eligibility comes in to play again. not that i dont think its legit, but i was wondering if anyone knew what the sop is when u get a new state record. do they give u polygraphs like some of the tourneys do? im sure some people will make a stink over this. what a fish, congrats to the anglers! 
Lets not go there thats an Ugly Movie.Just be happy for the man .
QUOTE (Mega Bite @ Mar 5 2006, 05:54 PM)
Lets not go there thats an Ugly Movie.Just be happy for the man .
Exactly right!!!!!! Read enough of that last year.........just imagine the patience it took not to try asnd just crank down on the drag and bulldog that one in!!!
They were out there again today (Fin Addict)...man, that's somebody who loves fishing for sure...catch a record on Saturday and back at it on Sunday !>......We had a good day....caught the end of the bight south of Sandbridge today...3 30 pounders in the boat before the bite turned off....the bird action today was unreal....most birds I've seen all year....strange thing is ..nobody catching under the birds....I will post a report a litte later...got pictures coming from Otter....
Oh yea...I had 2 chummers on the boat today !!!...I was LMAO.....
one had Yeagar last night...the other had more Beer than he should have....Bob
Oh yea...I had 2 chummers on the boat today !!!...I was LMAO.....
one had Yeagar last night...the other had more Beer than he should have....Bob
im not trying to go anywhere (as was CLEARLY STATED in my post along with a congratulation) i was just inquiring into the sop for state records. do they or dont they polygraph? im not trying to stir the pot here so dont try to put words in my mouth.
QUOTE (gus @ Mar 5 2006, 08:07 PM)
im not trying to go anywhere (as was CLEARLY STATED in my post along with a congratulation) i was just inquiring into the sop for state records. do they or dont they polygraph? im not trying to stir the pot here so dont try to put words in my mouth.
Mega's right Gus be happy for the guy after all he probably doesn't get to fish that often being a commercial fishing guy. (grin).......
What a slob! But there are bigger fish out there, and I expect someone on this webpage to break that record in the next year. 70 lbs is now the magic number. You don't have to have a 56 foot Carolina boat or 40 years experience. Just drive the damn boat over top of the fish and get her hooked up! Nothing to it! Let's get at it!!! 
I am ready for that Marlin.The pictures of that fish are great,that Cow had some stretch marks om her belly.
im perfectly happy for him, its quite a specimen. if we keep going at this rate the all tackle world record may be broken (78-8 i believe) in a few years. that fish caught in nj was determined to be 36 years old. the fish that is the new va record could easily have been spawned in the 70s, it may even be older than i am.
Thanks to you guys that aren't so critical of the commercial card. That fish could just as easily been caught by someone else, I was just in the right place at the right time with the right baits!!! Hey still thinkn, you were in the right place on Sunday - we hung another one just a touch smaller and lost him@ the door.
that is a beautiful fish. I think the rules should be left alone. the record for a striped bass is .... what ever that slob ends up weighing or her mother if she gets caught this week.
I read somewhere that reidville area a pound net had a striped bass that went like 99# should that be the record. I know that there is an 80+#er out there. it is just a matter of time. Look the jounalist are saying how strange to have on that big in March but heck if you stay on them year round you cant help but find some cows.
anyway Great fish and i am really glad to see more species size record falling each year. Minium sizes are getting bigger and more fish are being caught. The overall health of the bay is getting better.
that just my opinion i could be wrong.
I read somewhere that reidville area a pound net had a striped bass that went like 99# should that be the record. I know that there is an 80+#er out there. it is just a matter of time. Look the jounalist are saying how strange to have on that big in March but heck if you stay on them year round you cant help but find some cows.
anyway Great fish and i am really glad to see more species size record falling each year. Minium sizes are getting bigger and more fish are being caught. The overall health of the bay is getting better.
that just my opinion i could be wrong.
QUOTE (reelthunder @ Mar 6 2006, 03:44 PM)
Thanks to you guys that aren't so critical of the commercial card. That fish could just as easily been caught by someone else, I was just in the right place at the right time with the right baits!!! Hey still thinkn, you were in the right place on Sunday - we hung another one just a touch smaller and lost him@ the door.
Well said.....I KNOW I've had the world record on several times...the dam line just broke !!.....lol......Good job on that fish...it's not easy getting a 68# striper in the boat. I'm sure if we would have hooked him some of my crew would be coming back to the pier soaking wet because they would have been diving in to get that fish....lol.....Bob
QUOTE (reelthunder @ Mar 6 2006, 01:44 PM)
Thanks to you guys that aren't so critical of the commercial card. That fish could just as easily been caught by someone else, I was just in the right place at the right time with the right baits!!! Hey still thinkn, you were in the right place on Sunday - we hung another one just a touch smaller and lost him@ the door.
Great catch! Somebody had to do it, Way to go!
There was a 125lb Striped Bass caught back in the early 20th Century.I saw a Degreo Plate Photograph Of a Man standing next to the fish hanging from a block And Tackle in the back of a horse drawn wagon.The Caption said "125 lb Striped Bass." That fishes equal is out there I am sure.
I saw that picture Mega. I believe it was caught in a net down in Carolina somewhere. What a beast.
there may be more 100 lbs stripers than people think. a fish that large may have a different feeding cycle or keep to herself. a pattern of increasing lure size, as well as more elaborate presentations, is leading to bigger fish.
25 years ago the fish was an occasional catch while trolling for blues, but now they attack baits intended for other fish more often. when the next decade arrives the 100lbs barrier may fall when the first of the fish of a rebounding population starts turning 30 years old.
the best bet for a true monster is to go bigger. everyone, take a look at your box of lures, i know mine is starting to look like an offshore collection. from mirrolures to magnums, bigger is turning out to be better.
congratulations to an angler who raised the bar another notch.
25 years ago the fish was an occasional catch while trolling for blues, but now they attack baits intended for other fish more often. when the next decade arrives the 100lbs barrier may fall when the first of the fish of a rebounding population starts turning 30 years old.
the best bet for a true monster is to go bigger. everyone, take a look at your box of lures, i know mine is starting to look like an offshore collection. from mirrolures to magnums, bigger is turning out to be better.
congratulations to an angler who raised the bar another notch.
Look at this big ummm... whale 
http://www.stripers247.com/NewJerseyworldrecord.htm
world record striper
http://www.stripers247.com/NewJerseyworldrecord.htm
world record striper
The state fishing tournament is to promote recreational fishn.
Striper Huge and small feed on a number of different sized baits from Krill ,Sand eels,Spearing,to 13 inch Menhaden.I think they are size specific feeders thats why one day they hit small daisychain bucktails then a week later its Stretch 30`s and Bunker Spoons.I have tried the large bait approach sometimes it works sometimes it will get zero.I bet the best bet for a hawg in the 100 lb would be Live Baiting a spread on the Top,Mid depth and bottom with some live Bunker.Probably along a area where a deep channel is near a series of shoals.
Think I read an article in sport fishing about that guy Al and his life after he caught that Striper (a 2 part series?) last year. It was kinda sad to read the ending... kinda like the stock market... ya gotcha high's and lows. Based on his story, I would never want to catch the world record.
Now that I said that... where's that 68.5lbs. striper???
.
Bobby
Now that I said that... where's that 68.5lbs. striper???
.Bobby
Sorry All, I for one cannot support the decision to allow the catch as a new state record. The rule was in place because there is simply no way to prove a hook and line angler was commercial fishing or recreational fishing. The decision was overturned because the commission was threatened discriminatory actions last year. I beleive there is also an unfair advantage to commercial fishermen with regards to the resources they have access to and the amount of time and frequency spent on the water.
Nothing against the fisherman, nice fish.
Chief C
Nothing against the fisherman, nice fish.
Chief C
QUOTE (jcifuentes @ Mar 8 2006, 12:48 AM)
Sorry All, I for one cannot support the decision to allow the catch as a new state record. The rule was in place because there is simply no way to prove a hook and line angler was commercial fishing or recreational fishing. The decision was overturned because the commission was threatened discriminatory actions last year. I beleive there is also an unfair advantage to commercial fishermen with regards to the resources they have access to and the amount of time and frequency spent on the water.
Nothing against the fisherman, nice fish.
Chief C
Nothing against the fisherman, nice fish.
Chief C
There's a real easy way to prove it...polygraph. I've fished in Marlin tourneys before where, every boat turning in a catch sheet had a polygraph administered. If a catch is a potential state record, not just a citation fish, but a pending state record, then a polygraph should be given, no matter if the guy/gal is a recreational or commercial fisherman. Unfortunatley, a man's words aren't taken as his words any more. Try to submit an IGFA world record...we're talking line samples, sending in the lure caught on, pictures, and up to a 3 month process and review by several committees.
And saying since they spend more time on the water and have better resources they should not be allowed to participate is like saying guys like Mega Bite and Gigolot, that have work schedules that afford them to fish more often, shouldn't be allowed to receive citations for their fish. We have more resources at our disposal now than ever before...weather conditions, tide charts, SST, not to mention forums like this with guys posting detailed reports of their catches. Yeah we're not over fish everyday and hitting the MOB on our GPS so we can come back and start over again tomorrow. Our time tracking fish is done on the computer reading posts and looking at winds, tides and water temps. I'm a recreational guy to, but believe me, if I could work at night, I'd be fishing every day!!
But that shouldn't disallow me from being in the tournament. Like a bumpersticker says.."I say we fish 5 days and work 2"
My 2 cents for whatever it's worth.. It seems to me, that the state record is really about what happens from the time the rod fires until the fish is in landed. You can have the best information available on where they're located and what they're biting, but that doesn't mean you're going to get more of a chance at a record fish than anyone else. There's a huge element of luck involved in getting that spectacular fish to bite. It's a numbers game, you can put yourself in a favorable situation with information and the right baits etc. and you should get bit, but what size bites and how many is a variable that no one can control. When I was chasing King Salmon on Lake Ontario I was after big fish every time. I had one spectacular day where we boated close to a dozen and eight of them were over 30 lbs. one was 38 lbs and we lost one at the boat over 40. It was the only day of fishing that we ever had that was that good with both numbers and size. There was a 2 week long derby going and the top 10 places were separated by a total of 2 1/2 lbs. I was fishing with a charter and it was the best day that boat had ever had. I still have the biggest fish caught on that boat. He's a good fisherman but the fact is there were several boats catching good numbers of big fish that day. One of the other charter captains who I've also fished with and know him to be a good fisherman was fishing the same school, with the same baits and he got skunked. The following year the same situation was reversed we got skunked and he caught. If a guy has a commercial card and is fishing in a derby or tourney, I can see where that might be an unfair advantage. If a guy simply goes out fishing and a big one bites and he lands it legally and there's no evidence of wrong doing I personally would be inclined to let him have it. As I said, my 2 cents.. 
well said skinny - i agree 100 percent. i was wondering if they polygraph. no one answered my ? b4. i take it they dont now. it seems like a simple solution. the arguement that commercials have an advantage because of their time on the water is hooey. if thats their job so be it. not all the commercial holders are active either. everyone should be eligible, just take the poly seems like a simple solution. im surprised as many people in the poll have voted against the commercial eligibility. i dont understand it.
QUOTE (jcifuentes @ Mar 7 2006, 09:48 PM)
Sorry All, I for one cannot support the decision to allow the catch as a new state record. The rule was in place because there is simply no way to prove a hook and line angler was commercial fishing or recreational fishing. The decision was overturned because the commission was threatened discriminatory actions last year. I beleive there is also an unfair advantage to commercial fishermen with regards to the resources they have access to and the amount of time and frequency spent on the water.
Nothing against the fisherman, nice fish.
Chief C
Nothing against the fisherman, nice fish.
Chief C
If you think the commercial hook and liners have an unfair advantage, think about the Charter Captains who are out there just about every day and there is a whole lot more of them taking lots of people out there to catch fish, it's not the angler who puts them on the fish and sets the tackle, therefor with that frame of mind any fish caught on a Charter Boat should be disqualified. ( By the way I am a Charter Captain ) I was supprised the approval level was so high for the Commercial Hook & Line Guys since there is only about 200 of them in the whole State of Va., and only a small percentage of them in the Tidewater area and there has always seemed to be some sort of bandeta against them trying to make a living on the water. ( I am also a Commercial Hook & Line Fisherman-The only selective form of harvesting fish with no impact on the environment, and the most attacked because we don't have the money or resources to fight back.) I do go fishing for fun with family and friends just like all of you, When the boat leaves the dock its either a Charter, Commercial Trip, or a Recreation Family Trip, and and it can't change once you have started. If the fish is caught on hook and line like everyone else, and is not caught on a commercial trip and sold, It Should Count as a State or World Record Fish. Remember all those Bluefin records caught a few years back, well they were all sold commercially. I quess its who you know as to weather its an issue or not.
I think in Virginia there are a lot of recreational fisherman that purchase a commercial licence so they can sell a few fish. Years ago I held a NC licence for that reason. Then North Carolina started making you prove with tax records that a large % of your income came from commercial fishing in order to qualify.
My guess is that a lot of the commercial licence holders that are participating in the VSFT are actually fishing for fun 99% of the time.
My guess is that a lot of the commercial licence holders that are participating in the VSFT are actually fishing for fun 99% of the time.
My dad always had commercial licences. You had to have one to mess with hoop nets or catfish boxes.
We had a commercial shrimping license so we could dehead the shrimp while still on the water.
We had a commercial shrimping license so we could dehead the shrimp while still on the water.
Same here ..... I use to put out a half dozen crab pots behind my house in Southern Shores and pull a shrimp net in Kitty Hawk Bay at night.
Boy did I enjoy the softshell crab "by catch" that got caught in my shrimp net!!!
I also sold a couple of tunas and a dolphin or two to local restaurants ..... This was years ago, back in the good days .....
Licence was required for all of the above.
Boy did I enjoy the softshell crab "by catch" that got caught in my shrimp net!!!
I also sold a couple of tunas and a dolphin or two to local restaurants ..... This was years ago, back in the good days .....
Licence was required for all of the above.
Not letting Commercial Fisherman participate in the Virginia Saltwater Tournament is a form of discrimination.Just because they work on the water doesent mean they cant relax on the water also.Commercial fisherman have the same rights as anyone else in the Commonwealth.I bet Lawyers told them they didnt have a leg to stand on that is ultimately why they recended the Rule.
im pretty sure theres a good representation of commercials on the vmrc committee - id imagine thats another reason. the last reason may be common sense.
[/quote]
If you think the commercial hook and liners have an unfair advantage, think about the Charter Captains who are out there just about every day and there is a whole lot more of them taking lots of people out there to catch fish, it's not the angler who puts them on the fish and sets the tackle, therefor with that frame of mind any fish caught on a Charter Boat should be disqualified. ( By the way I am a Charter Captain ) I was supprised the approval level was so high for the Commercial Hook & Line Guys since there is only about 200 of them in the whole State of Va., and only a small percentage of them in the Tidewater area and there has always seemed to be some sort of bandeta against them trying to make a living on the water. ( I am also a Commercial Hook & Line Fisherman-The only selective form of harvesting fish with no impact on the environment, and the most attacked because we don't have the money or resources to fight back.) I do go fishing for fun with family and friends just like all of you, When the boat leaves the dock its either a Charter, Commercial Trip, or a Recreation Family Trip, and and it can't change once you have started. If the fish is caught on hook and line like everyone else, and is not caught on a commercial trip and sold, It Should Count as a State or World Record Fish. Remember all those Bluefin records caught a few years back, well they were all sold commercially. I quess its who you know as to weather its an issue or not.
[/quote]
I'm with Barnicle Bill... If I'm out on a charter and catch a state record.... I didn't put myself on it .... the captian did.
But if he's out wid da boys havun a good time and happens to land across a SR then by all means it should count. By the way, if anyting it'll give him some braggin' rights and the ability to advertise the SR catch, thus providing more booked charters thus providing a better living for the "waterman" of Va. In my book... promoting self wealth and providing a good time to others while doing it rates among the best jobs to have. Let's not fight it but support it.
It's reminds me of the Olympics. Prior to '92 any US cyclist that held a Professional Racing License could not be eligble for the US Olympic Team. But yet the "ameatures" were supposed to represent the best of America? Meanwhile the American Professionals are racing in Europe making a great living (or not) while watching the Olympics being televised, "the so-called Ametures" loose to the Germans that held a"Professional Racing Licence".
The outcome should not be taken away based on profession or luck. And in both sports that is exactly what it is.... Luck.
"Freedom of Speech" should be "Freedom of Rules"...
Okay, I just opened myself for an onslought of insults but I'm open minded..... Bring ‘em on!!!!
Bobby
If you think the commercial hook and liners have an unfair advantage, think about the Charter Captains who are out there just about every day and there is a whole lot more of them taking lots of people out there to catch fish, it's not the angler who puts them on the fish and sets the tackle, therefor with that frame of mind any fish caught on a Charter Boat should be disqualified. ( By the way I am a Charter Captain ) I was supprised the approval level was so high for the Commercial Hook & Line Guys since there is only about 200 of them in the whole State of Va., and only a small percentage of them in the Tidewater area and there has always seemed to be some sort of bandeta against them trying to make a living on the water. ( I am also a Commercial Hook & Line Fisherman-The only selective form of harvesting fish with no impact on the environment, and the most attacked because we don't have the money or resources to fight back.) I do go fishing for fun with family and friends just like all of you, When the boat leaves the dock its either a Charter, Commercial Trip, or a Recreation Family Trip, and and it can't change once you have started. If the fish is caught on hook and line like everyone else, and is not caught on a commercial trip and sold, It Should Count as a State or World Record Fish. Remember all those Bluefin records caught a few years back, well they were all sold commercially. I quess its who you know as to weather its an issue or not.
[/quote]
I'm with Barnicle Bill... If I'm out on a charter and catch a state record.... I didn't put myself on it .... the captian did.
But if he's out wid da boys havun a good time and happens to land across a SR then by all means it should count. By the way, if anyting it'll give him some braggin' rights and the ability to advertise the SR catch, thus providing more booked charters thus providing a better living for the "waterman" of Va. In my book... promoting self wealth and providing a good time to others while doing it rates among the best jobs to have. Let's not fight it but support it.
It's reminds me of the Olympics. Prior to '92 any US cyclist that held a Professional Racing License could not be eligble for the US Olympic Team. But yet the "ameatures" were supposed to represent the best of America? Meanwhile the American Professionals are racing in Europe making a great living (or not) while watching the Olympics being televised, "the so-called Ametures" loose to the Germans that held a"Professional Racing Licence".
The outcome should not be taken away based on profession or luck. And in both sports that is exactly what it is.... Luck.
"Freedom of Speech" should be "Freedom of Rules"...
Okay, I just opened myself for an onslought of insults but I'm open minded..... Bring ‘em on!!!!
Bobby
if you hold a valid permit to fish and have a rod and reel, then that should be good enough.
All, I acknowledge everyone’s opinions and likewise would like to express mine. Instead of writing everything down again, I would like to quote a portion of an email between myself and Mr. Lee Tolliver who wrote the initial article in the VA Pilot (read from bottom up).
Mr. Tolliver took the time to listen to my concerns and express my opinions. I believe I may have even shed some light as to why I believe commercial hook and line fishermen should not be permitted to participate and why they hold an unfair advantage.
I believe this topic will go down in the history books as unresolved.
Chief C
-----Original Message-----
From: Cifuentes, Jorge [mailto:jorge.cifuentes@bearingpoint.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 1:26 PM
To: Lee Tolliver
Cc: mrcswt@visi.net; ccavast@aol.com
Subject: RE: VA state record
Lee, nor do I. It is a shame to hear that this great program may be
discontinued, but if the rules cannot be fair or enforced I
unfortunately agree with the decision. I hope this discussion has shed
some light from a true recreational fisherman's perspective.
The more I think about it the more I think you should do a follow up
commentary on the unfortunate future fate of the VASFT.
Wish I could oblige you with your request, but I’ve got to travel this
weekend (work related).
Jorge
PS, Mr. Claude Baine, Mr. John Bellow in light of your lack of response
to topic in discussion I concede that you are in agreement with the
current ruling. Shame.
-----Original Message-----
From: Lee Tolliver [mailto:Lee.Tolliver@pilotonline.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 11:56 AM
To: Cifuentes, Jorge
Subject: RE: VA state record
Jorge, you are a man who knows his stuff
I surely don't want to get entwined in a big debate about this
On last year's fish, your facts are in tune with what I have heard. This year's fish will have to go through a new process because it is a state record. The entire crew is being sent forms to fill out and sign that are legally binding that could get them in trouble if they lied. And if anybody wants to challenge the catch, they will be forced to take a lie-detector test...
Armstrong possesses only bay tags and would be breaking the law in
several ways if he was commercially fishing in the ocean......
And there is a "little" bit of luck involved
But you are right on with your comments.....it's one of those damned if
you do, damned if you don't situations
And don't be surprised if the program is eliminated in a few years
anyway, partly because of some pending changes and partly because of
issues like this one
Hey, you could clear it all up for us.....go out there Thursday or
Friday and nab a 70-pounder
lee
-----Original Message-----
From: Cifuentes, Jorge [mailto:jorge.cifuentes@bearingpoint.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 10:48 AM
To: Lee Tolliver
Cc: mrcswt@visi.net; ccavast@aol.com
Subject: RE: VA state record
Lee, your points are acknowledged, but allow me to provide some insight
myself. I was aware of the panel and that they had received extreme pressure for an organized commercial fishermen panel/commission.
The decision was changed by the panel simply because there was a threat
of a discriminatory lawsuit, which I believe never would have held water in court simply because of what I stated there is a conflict of
interest.
I cannot speak for Mr. Armstron, but I can speak for the individual who
caught last years record fish which was denied. I witnessed the culling of stripers in his boat and the selling of catch from his home. As the saying goes apples do not fall far from their tree. I believe the "tricks of the trade" are common practice among commercial fishermen. I would like to think more positively about this subject but simply cannot, based on the events I have seen and heard from fishing enthusiasts. Don't get me wrong, I am not naïve enough to think that there aren't recreational fishermen who break the rules also, but taken into consideration the quantity and frequency of the catch I believe the damage is far less.
With regards to whether commercial fishermen do have an advantage over a recreational fisherman. I simply cannot recall the last time I was able to call my recreational fishing buddies to get an "Arial" report from spotter planes as to the location of bait pods or fish schools. I also cannot simply call and get access to large sport fishing vessels decked out with state of the art electronics and equipment which also have the capability to go out in undesirable conditions. The networking is also a key advantage. In comparison it would be like placing you and I in a contest to see which one of us collects the most breaking news reports in the Hampton Rds area the quickest. With your resources as a
newspaper journalist who do you think would win?
Last but not least, what will be the determining factor of verifying
whether they put out that day on a recreational fishing trip or a
commercial fishing trip?
Again, the very same people who hold this advantage are to receive
recognition from a state sanctioned commission as the bearer of a trophy fish. The fish will definitely bring with it monetary endorsements from a various array of manufacturers i.e.. lure, line, rod and reel etc, or personal appearances/adds. There is a vast array of amenities the bearer of a state record fish will receive all endorsed by a state commission. I disagree that his catch was based on primarily luck.
To quote a line from my Daddy "Rules are in place primarily to keep an
honest man honest".
It is sad to see that we could not continue following the fair rules
which were once in place. I believe we have beat this horse to death.
Thank you for your insight.
Jorge
Copy: Mr. Claude Baine, Mr. John Bellow
-----Original Message-----
From: Lee Tolliver [mailto:Lee.Tolliver@pilotonline.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 9:30 AM
To: Cifuentes, Jorge
Subject: RE: VA state record
Jorge, I need to correct you on a few things that you seem to
misunderstand
Decisions made for the saltwater tournament are not made by the VMRC
commission. There is an independent advisory panel comprised solely of
recreational fishermen that decide matters concerning the awards
program. This group of recreationals is the one that decided to change
the rule. The old rule allowed commercial fishermen to participate in the program, but not commercial rod-and-reelers.....it had been brought up before the panel in the past, but after the big striper caught last year by a rod and reeler that wasn't allowed as a new state record, the discussion got more intense. Many on the panel worried about it being a discrimatory issue that only one small group was not allowed.
So the change was made....
Also on another point you made. Commercial rod-and-reelers have little
to no more advantage over recreational anglers. In fact, commercial rod
and reelers are little more than recreational anglers who are allowed to sell a portion of their catch....
Mr. Armstrong, while being a business owner with the luxury of getting
to go fishing more, had little advantage over any of the other striper
fishermen out that day
His catch, while slightly based on skill and knowledge, was a whole lot
of luck...that's the case with any trophy fish
Again, thanx for your input. I hope that some of my above explanation
helps you.
Lee
Mr. Tolliver took the time to listen to my concerns and express my opinions. I believe I may have even shed some light as to why I believe commercial hook and line fishermen should not be permitted to participate and why they hold an unfair advantage.
I believe this topic will go down in the history books as unresolved.
Chief C
QUOTE
-----Original Message-----
From: Cifuentes, Jorge [mailto:jorge.cifuentes@bearingpoint.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 1:26 PM
To: Lee Tolliver
Cc: mrcswt@visi.net; ccavast@aol.com
Subject: RE: VA state record
Lee, nor do I. It is a shame to hear that this great program may be
discontinued, but if the rules cannot be fair or enforced I
unfortunately agree with the decision. I hope this discussion has shed
some light from a true recreational fisherman's perspective.
The more I think about it the more I think you should do a follow up
commentary on the unfortunate future fate of the VASFT.
Wish I could oblige you with your request, but I’ve got to travel this
weekend (work related).
Jorge
PS, Mr. Claude Baine, Mr. John Bellow in light of your lack of response
to topic in discussion I concede that you are in agreement with the
current ruling. Shame.
-----Original Message-----
From: Lee Tolliver [mailto:Lee.Tolliver@pilotonline.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 11:56 AM
To: Cifuentes, Jorge
Subject: RE: VA state record
Jorge, you are a man who knows his stuff
I surely don't want to get entwined in a big debate about this
On last year's fish, your facts are in tune with what I have heard. This year's fish will have to go through a new process because it is a state record. The entire crew is being sent forms to fill out and sign that are legally binding that could get them in trouble if they lied. And if anybody wants to challenge the catch, they will be forced to take a lie-detector test...
Armstrong possesses only bay tags and would be breaking the law in
several ways if he was commercially fishing in the ocean......
And there is a "little" bit of luck involved
But you are right on with your comments.....it's one of those damned if
you do, damned if you don't situations
And don't be surprised if the program is eliminated in a few years
anyway, partly because of some pending changes and partly because of
issues like this one
Hey, you could clear it all up for us.....go out there Thursday or
Friday and nab a 70-pounder
lee
-----Original Message-----
From: Cifuentes, Jorge [mailto:jorge.cifuentes@bearingpoint.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 10:48 AM
To: Lee Tolliver
Cc: mrcswt@visi.net; ccavast@aol.com
Subject: RE: VA state record
Lee, your points are acknowledged, but allow me to provide some insight
myself. I was aware of the panel and that they had received extreme pressure for an organized commercial fishermen panel/commission.
The decision was changed by the panel simply because there was a threat
of a discriminatory lawsuit, which I believe never would have held water in court simply because of what I stated there is a conflict of
interest.
I cannot speak for Mr. Armstron, but I can speak for the individual who
caught last years record fish which was denied. I witnessed the culling of stripers in his boat and the selling of catch from his home. As the saying goes apples do not fall far from their tree. I believe the "tricks of the trade" are common practice among commercial fishermen. I would like to think more positively about this subject but simply cannot, based on the events I have seen and heard from fishing enthusiasts. Don't get me wrong, I am not naïve enough to think that there aren't recreational fishermen who break the rules also, but taken into consideration the quantity and frequency of the catch I believe the damage is far less.
With regards to whether commercial fishermen do have an advantage over a recreational fisherman. I simply cannot recall the last time I was able to call my recreational fishing buddies to get an "Arial" report from spotter planes as to the location of bait pods or fish schools. I also cannot simply call and get access to large sport fishing vessels decked out with state of the art electronics and equipment which also have the capability to go out in undesirable conditions. The networking is also a key advantage. In comparison it would be like placing you and I in a contest to see which one of us collects the most breaking news reports in the Hampton Rds area the quickest. With your resources as a
newspaper journalist who do you think would win?
Last but not least, what will be the determining factor of verifying
whether they put out that day on a recreational fishing trip or a
commercial fishing trip?
Again, the very same people who hold this advantage are to receive
recognition from a state sanctioned commission as the bearer of a trophy fish. The fish will definitely bring with it monetary endorsements from a various array of manufacturers i.e.. lure, line, rod and reel etc, or personal appearances/adds. There is a vast array of amenities the bearer of a state record fish will receive all endorsed by a state commission. I disagree that his catch was based on primarily luck.
To quote a line from my Daddy "Rules are in place primarily to keep an
honest man honest".
It is sad to see that we could not continue following the fair rules
which were once in place. I believe we have beat this horse to death.
Thank you for your insight.
Jorge
Copy: Mr. Claude Baine, Mr. John Bellow
-----Original Message-----
From: Lee Tolliver [mailto:Lee.Tolliver@pilotonline.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 9:30 AM
To: Cifuentes, Jorge
Subject: RE: VA state record
Jorge, I need to correct you on a few things that you seem to
misunderstand
Decisions made for the saltwater tournament are not made by the VMRC
commission. There is an independent advisory panel comprised solely of
recreational fishermen that decide matters concerning the awards
program. This group of recreationals is the one that decided to change
the rule. The old rule allowed commercial fishermen to participate in the program, but not commercial rod-and-reelers.....it had been brought up before the panel in the past, but after the big striper caught last year by a rod and reeler that wasn't allowed as a new state record, the discussion got more intense. Many on the panel worried about it being a discrimatory issue that only one small group was not allowed.
So the change was made....
Also on another point you made. Commercial rod-and-reelers have little
to no more advantage over recreational anglers. In fact, commercial rod
and reelers are little more than recreational anglers who are allowed to sell a portion of their catch....
Mr. Armstrong, while being a business owner with the luxury of getting
to go fishing more, had little advantage over any of the other striper
fishermen out that day
His catch, while slightly based on skill and knowledge, was a whole lot
of luck...that's the case with any trophy fish
Again, thanx for your input. I hope that some of my above explanation
helps you.
Lee
QUOTE ...."Also on another point you made. Commercial rod and reelers have little to no more advantage over recreational anglers. In fact, commercial rod and reelers are little more than recreational anglers who are allowed to sell a portion of their catch..."
What this is coming down to is that Virginia will do what NC did. Limit commercial licence holders to those that can show on their previous year IRS tax form that 15% of their income came from commercial fishing or they can't renew their commercial ticket. Hate to see it happen.
What this is coming down to is that Virginia will do what NC did. Limit commercial licence holders to those that can show on their previous year IRS tax form that 15% of their income came from commercial fishing or they can't renew their commercial ticket. Hate to see it happen.
Since we're talking about big Stripers, I must say that I know for a fact that there are alot of Stripers well over 100#'s out there and I 'll tell you why...... I had a brother in law ( past tense & thank god for that) that used to commercial fish rockfish in the James about 5 yrs ago, and he was one of those ol' country boys that could tell fish story after fish story about these 100# plus rocks that he would catch in his nets, of course I would never believe him after witnessing half of the drugs he's consumed in his life, till one day he shows up in this little toyota pick up with 10 fish in the back of his truck that had his springs burried in the axle,.....you don't believe it till you see it with your own eyes....we weighed the largest and the smallest.....smallest went 101# with the largest @ 118#....he caught these fish with his nets just off the beach near Surry nuclear jetty in about 6feet of water....the big ones are out there!
QUOTE (brn2surf @ Mar 9 2006, 09:15 AM)
Since we're talking about big Stripers, I must say that I know for a fact that there are alot of Stripers well over 100#'s out there and I 'll tell you why...... I had a brother in law ( past tense & thank god for that) that used to commercial fish rockfish in the James about 5 yrs ago, and he was one of those ol' country boys that could tell fish story after fish story about these 100# plus rocks that he would catch in his nets, of course I would never believe him after witnessing half of the drugs he's consumed in his life, till one day he shows up in this little toyota pick up with 10 fish in the back of his truck that had his springs burried in the axle,.....you don't believe it till you see it with your own eyes....we weighed the largest and the smallest.....smallest went 101# with the largest @ 118#....he caught these fish with his nets just off the beach near Surry nuclear jetty in about 6feet of water....the big ones are out there!
WOW!!!! It's just a matter of time!!!! 100+
Next move for the big fish off the Virginia coast now is inland to spawn, right? That should happen any day now, right?
THATS CRAZY!!!! 
what time of the year was it becuase if it was around the spring striper season then thast where im gunna go fishin!!!!!!!
did you take any pics of the fish?
what time of the year was it becuase if it was around the spring striper season then thast where im gunna go fishin!!!!!!!did you take any pics of the fish?
There are pros and cons to this issue, and everyone has a right to their opinion and usually pretty good reasons why they feel the way they feel. That said, I would like to just say that even though there is a wide diversity of opinions on this issue, it's really nice to see that the people on this board have the common courtesy to discuss this without getting nasty with each other. There are some other boards that I get on that this level of discussion would likely degenerate into meaness. 
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